Aircraft Distance? not enough?

tomauer · **on:** April 05, 2007, 03:39:53 pm

Okay, I recieved a new 744 with one more due to arrive next month, the thing is, i cannot fly a route that is less distance than the aircraft can fly, here you go:

Manila-Planned Destination(hidden for security reasons

, im protective)

Distance: 7,303nm
Aircraft Range: 8349nm

yet i cannot get 1x single frequency!

I used http://www.airrouting.com/content/tdcalc.html to get the REAL world information for the route distance etc, heres what i got:

Nautical Miles : 6334.92 (aircraft range=8349nm)-(AM distance= 7,303nm)
Statute Miles : 7291.65
Kilometers : 11732.27
Trip Time : 11:25 (includes 15 minute bias)

(info is at the 744's speed in kts)

even if it Is around 11hrs and there MUST be a round trip, i SHOULD make the trip in the 744. but i CANNOT! (round trips only is stupid btw, we gotta work around it for connection flights, in future )

I should be able to do the route, but obviously theres something wrong with distances etc.. Not good, for me and a lot of others. The Actual distance between the airports is WAY off, but even though, the aircraft in theory can fly the route in real life and AM, including turn times.

just me? Would be nice to hear from others on the issue.. thanks for reading

-tom

Air Elbonia · **Reply #1 on:** April 05, 2007, 03:55:45 pm

you turn a plane twice, not once (though the system seems to have no issue going into negative hours now and then).

11:25 flight
2.09 hr turn
11:25 flight
2.09 hour turn

that's total trip time for a round trip flight.

22.87 hrs in air (roughly)
4.18 hours on ground

27.05 total hours ~

we still should have one way (or .5 frequency) steps.

MrOrange · **Reply #2 on:** April 05, 2007, 05:48:53 pm

I have a 744 with -7 hours, flying AMS-JFK (I think) twice a day. So that's kinda weird.

SCA CEO · **Reply #3 on:** April 05, 2007, 09:39:30 pm

Yeah, stops should be allowed and long range aircraft should be alotted more hours to fly!

MrOrange · **Reply #4 on:** April 05, 2007, 10:49:27 pm

Quote from: "SCA CEO"

Yeah, stops should be allowed and long range aircraft should be alotted more hours to fly!

What exactly do you mean with "more hours to fly"? I mean, 24 is like the maximum number of hours you can fit in a day

That, or maybe I just didn't really get the point

d1-3508 · **Reply #5 on:** April 05, 2007, 11:00:12 pm

Someone (I think Virgin) has Minus 8 hours...

Really, it should be possible to have one-way long distance flights.

SCA CEO · **Reply #6 on:** April 05, 2007, 11:53:22 pm

What I meant by "longer hours" is by putting long range aircraft with that capability on 2 day rotation.

It hardly seems economical to have a long range aircraft making 350,000 per day. I have 737's and MD-90's making close to 500,000 and 600,000! Even more possibly and it's all in one day.

I say put 744's on two day rotations because in real life it does take some flights to go 25 hours (that's one way too).

tomauer · **Reply #7 on:** April 06, 2007, 03:35:13 am

yes thats a good idea, 2day rotations etc..

A simple way to work around it is the aircraft Shedule, Should go in DAYS, so depart early morning, arrive late afternoon. and return the next day. (to do this, you must plan in days, FREQ only on Mondays, Wednesdays etc..) understand?

This will involve a more advanced route procedure, although it is highly realistic, In future AMO will have an hour by the hour planning system correct? thats what was with the BETA AMO, We could plan the exact hour and day of the flight.

Well I hope this happens, because it defeats the purpose of a Long Haul, I have comparable 737 routes..

d1-3508 · **Reply #8 on:** April 06, 2007, 04:03:20 am

What'd be also nice would be stopovers, but that's a pipedream.

tomauer · **Reply #9 on:** April 06, 2007, 11:08:58 am

That is totally correct, Stopovers should and must be implemented (sometime) obviously in future

But first things first.

SCA CEO · **Reply #10 on:** April 07, 2007, 01:07:32 am

It's pretty pathetic that a 767-300ER wit ha range of 5900 nm can't go more than 5400 nm. That really kills me because that excludes A LOT of destinations on my route map. Really screws me over, perhaps if aircraft can only travel a certain distance on a 24 hour rotation, maybe that distance should be portrayed and not the full real world distance?

I've spent a lot of money on orders that in the end ended up not helping me at all because of this. This really is a problem because now I'm bought 7 767-300ER's, had them delivered and they can't go farther than 5400 nm! I can only go to Average international airports making less profit than what I should be making were I to go to an airport say that's 5700 nm out. I got the one with the 5900nm engines too.

SCA CEO · **Reply #11 on:** April 09, 2007, 05:41:43 pm

So yeah, 4 A340-300's came in for me. I can't go more than 5500 NM with any of them despite the aircraft having a range in the 6000's.

tomauer · **Reply #12 on:** April 10, 2007, 01:56:10 am

Damn, that sucks. My 2x A343's came in today as well, Looks like I will have to revise all my routes, this is a stupid problem! hehe, In real life Philippine Airlines Fly there A340's to Vancouver, Los Angeles then to Las Vegas. Heck they even flew them to Zurich at one point, There needs to be some sort of special feature for having long haul aircraft, Like Pacific Blue mentioned, 2-day rotations sound excellent, That will mean a more advanced route making process, but if you can't work out timetables you shouldn't be on AM. STOPOVERS!! woo hoo! we need them badly! There would have to be a restriction on them, so airlines don't make there Dash-8's fly Tokyo-Los Angeles via 50 island airports

, Mayby something similar to "focus" cities. Where you can connect flights via the city, but the flight has to arrive from one of your HUB's or Focus Cities' . And there sadly will have to be a limit (and price), IMO , We don't won't an airline with 500 connections in 500 other peoples Bases do we now.

Air Elbonia · **Reply #13 on:** April 10, 2007, 02:04:59 am

why not simply modify the current system.

frequency drop downs are in .5 increments (.5 being one way) thus accomodating long flights of up to 24 hours (+ the system's mercy, essentially adding round trip 48 hour terms for long range planes). Then if you really want stopovers, make every non-focus city able to have a single flight leave it.

this ONLY works, however, if you ensure that planes cannot defy the laws of physics anymore, otherwise it becomes too easy to abuse. by this i mean:

A plane not on any routes appears in any focus city starting point. a plane serving a route, FocusCity - Dest1 has the capacity to hop Dest1-Dest2. only one plane can depart Dest1 in total. This keeps a euro airline from popping up dollar flights from manilla with a dash-8 killing demand but allows for stopovers. all it would really take is a modification of the backend (always round frequencies up to account for slots used, add a seperate or subpage for the tertiary flights from other cities).

At worst this could have the effect of creating a 7th focus city for an airline anywhere in the reasonable world but it would be unlikely if you cannot start raw planes from destination cities.

d1-3508 · **Reply #14 on:** April 10, 2007, 11:35:54 am

Quote

There would have to be a restriction on them, so airlines don't make there Dash-8's fly Tokyo-Los Angeles via 50 island airports

The maxium would most likely be 2.

Reason being, in real life, there was a pair of Varig flights (9936/9937?) that used to fly: Tokyo Narita-Los Angeles-Rio-Sao Paulo.