error in finance

[mproger@gmail.com]

Stephen, i've got to congratulate you on taking on the task of setting up this mammoth simulation game.  But i've found it very frustrating, maybe it's because i use IE - but the navigation is very frustrating (important buttons are always hidden in weird places near the bottom of the screen) - the manual/directions isn't very imformative  and of course a link from airline mogul takes you to stephenm.org where you discover that you aren't already registered.  If this is such a vital piece of the airline mogul game, how come my airline mogul usersname wasn't already activated here.  

Well - here's my major bug - i'm Mai Tai Air (MTI) airline ID 6335 my operations log showed that i owed 350k, while my finance showed i owed 350million.  at the time the numbers were exactly the same except the addition of a zero

358,081 mysteriously became 3,508,081 with an added zero between 5 and 8.  I personally think this is way to coincidental to be a mistake on my part.  But it's entirely possible as the finance sheet and operations sheet is really confusing.

there are no real column headings to describe anything like if the numbers are talking about the current month. etc. etc.

then earlier today i got a message from a leasor that my lease was running out in 3 months, and i also got an email today saying that the lease had run out ( for plane 4416) and that the plane had been returned.

if 24 hours = 1 game month, then how is that possible that 3 months would pass on 22October ?

Another thing is that my ASE gate has been flagged for not being utilised.  well, that's fine - but i already followed the steps to return that gate.  So why was it flagged for not being utilised? Why wasn't it returned?

I also have a question about how leases/gate rentals work - are they charge on a pro-rated basis.  If not, then people who join at the wrong time are at a significant disadvantage.  if i only get 1 or 2 days service out of my plane while i have to pay for a full month rent you can see that would be crummy.

I'm hoping you'll say that if i switch to mozilla or something that all these problems will disappear.  But i'm guessing you won't and i'll be googling for other airline simulations.

thanks mate!

[dktc]

mmk... as someone would like to put it, this is not the "blue" game. We actually take care of the bugs, investigate them, and make any neceesary changes and/or refunds. We understand your frustration, but you don't need to put in that "I will google other games" thread :wink:
Things do get done here.

[Air Elbonia]

Finance  typically should be lower then your operations department numbers.  Operations is a lifetime page, finance is this month and this month only (projected remainder of the month on the right, to-date this month on the left).  IF the 350m is in operations and 350k is in finance, there's a chance you've been paying 350k a month for 10 months to make 3.5m (i assume by "addition of 0" you mean 3.5m instead of 350m which would be 3 zeros).

leasing, there's a few rogue bugs in.. which I'm in the process of fixing.  Mostly due to some weird behavior i think i know the source of but have been busy in real life and unable to quite get to yet.  working on it at the moment, but for some reason some old leases are laying around in the wrong way in the backend which is the cause of the interference/mis-return.  Sorry, about that. was it/is it aircraft id 4416? let me know and i can partially refund you.

Gates are flagged for utilization a month before being automatically returned.  If you return a gate, use up enough slots to undo the flag, the flag will stay there until the next month change.  This is to prevent some easy dodging of the gate return script, however. if you have no excess gates at the base, or use up enough slots that no gates qualify as excess, you have nothing to worry about. the flag will be removed automatically.

Leases/gate rentals are charged on the 1st of each month at the preset rate.  you rent a 50k gate, you pay 50k every month.  You pick up a lease for 5 months at 150,000 you pay that user 150,000 each month until the lease expires and the plane is automatically returned, or until you return the plane yourself (there is presently no fee to return a plane prematurely).

and sorry about the ugly navigation at times, it's a little better in firefox (a lot of that double bar at the top is consolidated into some dropdowns) and we're working on it as best we can, but unfortunately it's likely to stay a little ugly for a while longer.

[mproger@gmail.com]

AE  - thanks for looking into.

The plane was 4416, i'd like to look up the terms of the lease, and how long i had the plane - but i can't.

When i'm at the finance page i click the "go to the operations department to find out where your money is really going"
When i'm there, there is a "view" link that i can click to see a detailed report for each item.

that view link does not work.


Another thing is that in the past i thought of Profit as being Total Revenue minus Total Costs
but I think for purposes of the game Profit is Total Revenue minus a select amount of Costs (i.e. fuel, crew, staff)  but direct operating costs such as the amount it takes to lease a gate and plane.

Now i'm still confused about how 24 hours = 1 game month and 1 hour = 1 game day.  Does this mean that all game months only have 24 days?

Assuming that the Daily Operating Profit isn't actually the daily operating profit since it doesn't include all costs, that means you have 24 days to make up the cost of your plane and the cost of your gates.

In my case i'm flying a leased dc-3 at 550k plus a gate at lax 350k plus a gate at say SFO (300k)
that's 1.2 million in costs that are not reflect on the balance sheet (because they aren't in the daily operating profit)

which means the first 50k of daily operating profit isn't actually profit (1.2 million / 24 game days a game month)


a lot of headache could be removed it this was explained to newbies.
Also - i originally had no idea that 1 day = 1 game month, so i got totally screwed and one of my free gates was taken away from me.  

the game requires people to learn it very quickly in order to not be penalized.

Again, I still don't like the idea that you rent a gate for a month no matter if you rent it at noon or 8pm
Also, i don't like the idea that you are penalized for returning gates/planes.  When you return a gate or plane you instantly return it - instead of at the end of the month.  So if i return a gate on the 3rd day of the month - i have to pay for a full months use.  Or if I return a plane on the 8th day of the month i have to pay for using it for the full month.

the solution would to either make all changes effective at the start of the month (i.e. you signal your desire to return a plane on the 8th but it won't actually be returned until the end of the month) or to pro-rate everything (you only owe 8/24ths of your lease for that month)

additionally it would be easy to amoritze the costs of gate rental and plane leasing over the month so that these costs are reflected in the "daily operating profit" and then the "daily operating profit" would actually show the real profit.

[Air Elbonia]

Lease fees refunded (totalling to 2,000,000) and any remaining errant leases associated with 4416 have been disabled.  Sorry again about that, we really do try to fix bugs as soon as possible.

clicking the view link works for me for anything with over 0 in either the debit or credit column, even in your account.  It should show all transactions of that type in your history.

DOP, Daily Operating Profit.  Slightly different from Total Profit, yes, maybe a little confusing.  Sorry about that.  it's now, however, a pretty commonly known term.  You'll see it not only here but in several other airline simulations out there.  I'll think about amortizing leases/gate fees and incorporating them into this number, but it might not happen for a few weeks.

24 hours = 1 game month, 1 hour = 1 game day, all game months have 24 "days" yes.  a conceit made to keep it relatively simple and consistant.

With regards to proration:  Gates, yeah, sorry it's never prorated, ever.  Unlikely to change in the near future... so many things to do (unfortunately).  Leases, unless returned early you actually gain a few days on the lease.  Assuming it runs through to expiration, it will only process as "ended" on the 1st of each month, so if you rent it on the 17th for that month you only pay for the 17th-24th. however, the last month, you pay for 1st-17th (when it "should" be returned by the counter hitting 0 days/months/years left) and youu get the 18th-24th for free.  if returned early it's not prorated. that's the closest thing in the game to an early cancellation penalty (and it's pretty mild compared to most all real penalties of the type).

Please don't take any of this as me shooting down ideas for my own "brilliance" or what-have-you, at the moment i'm working on a system to get multiple worlds going at once (to ease some overcrowding in the game) which requires around 225 files to be updated... little daunting, little time consuming.

[mproger@gmail.com]

okay , so around 7:30 I checked and it was like the 15 November
and i was in the hole.  down about -92k

then 1 day later (8:30am eastern) i'm up to 4million cash on hand

WTF? my DOP is only 380k

[Jps]

Read the post above you...lease costs returned