Title: RIP
Post by: airplane2011@msn.com on April 03, 2008, 04:06:23 am
I know they filed for Chapter 11, but did they have to cease all operations?
Title: RIP
Post by: Vamerica on April 03, 2008, 04:23:01 am
The closing of them was because of gas prices. Gas prices are killing every airline in america.
Title: RIP
Post by: AirHanoverInternational on April 03, 2008, 08:29:56 am
Quote from: "airplane2011@msn.com"
I know they filed for Chapter 11, but did they have to cease all operations?
AFAIK they ceased all passenger operations 31rd March. Cargo biz will go on until others will provide this (mainly inter-island postal service).
Title: RIP
Post by: SATA on April 03, 2008, 03:45:21 pm
ATA has anounced closure too :shock:
Title: RIP
Post by: Hampo on April 03, 2008, 11:50:37 pm
ATA lost all their Reach troop flights and with todays fuel prices running those old L1011's and DC10's isnt viable for them, shame, another great airline lost.
Title: RIP ATA
Post by: Vamerica on April 03, 2008, 11:55:01 pm
Title: RIP
Post by: Vamerica on April 03, 2008, 11:59:27 pm
now, who next?
Title: RIP
Post by: SATA on April 04, 2008, 12:39:03 am
Quote from: "Hampo"
ATA lost all their Reach troop flights and with todays fuel prices running those old L1011's and DC10's isnt viable for them, shame, another great airline lost.
Shame for the short haul fleet too those 738's will hopefully go to a good airline :roll:
Title: RIP
Post by: SATA on April 04, 2008, 12:39:54 am
Quote from: "Vamerica"
now, who next?
Oh i think Kalitta Air cargo will be next cause they only operate the 741 and 742 and there so fuel thirsty.
Title: RIP
Post by: Vamerica on April 04, 2008, 12:49:40 am
I say the airlines that wont be going away are(United States Airlines)
United American US Airways Delta Virgin America(they have so much baking from Virgin Group, so i say there safe) NWA(is meant to merge soon, i think) Continental(also is merging soon) South West(there the fastest airline growing in america)
ON THE EDGE...
I say Fronter, they bight be able to stay
WHAT IS YOUR THOUGHTS...
on Alaska and Horizon(horizon is a small commuter of Alaska, so there like the same).
Title: RIP
Post by: SATA on April 04, 2008, 12:53:47 am
United have grounded all there 777's (52) for some safety thing so i dont think they will go or unless they still arnt making a profit :roll:
Title: RIP
Post by: Vamerica on April 04, 2008, 12:56:38 am
your getting this all from Airliners.net
well that means there paying less gas toe.
Title: RIP
Post by: SATA on April 04, 2008, 12:57:44 am
im not getting all this from Anet and yed thats a good point but theyll be back soon
Title: RIP
Post by: Vamerica on April 04, 2008, 01:00:05 am
yes.
one question. As I knew, ATA was now owned SouthWest
Title: RIP
Post by: SATA on April 04, 2008, 01:02:53 am
Quote from: "Vamerica"
yes.
one question. As I knew, ATA was now owned SouthWest
what? :?
Title: RIP
Post by: Vamerica on April 04, 2008, 01:08:16 am
as i knew, SouthWest Airlines(SWA) bought out ATA a couple years ago. Even there Inflight Magazine for SouthWest says "Vacation Package City Service Operated By ATA Airlines" or "Service Operated By ATA Airlines"
Title: RIP
Post by: Vamerica on April 04, 2008, 01:09:24 am
Title: RIP
Post by: SATA on April 04, 2008, 01:12:00 am
thats probably the last time youll see them in that good condition :(
Title: RIP
Post by: Vamerica on April 04, 2008, 01:13:54 am
well, they will get sold or scraped. I wish there sold. I hate to see a 737-200 be scraped.
Title: RIP
Post by: SATA on April 04, 2008, 01:14:42 am
same but its most likely they will
Title: RIP
Post by: Vamerica on April 04, 2008, 01:16:14 am
depends
Title: RIP
Post by: SATA on April 04, 2008, 01:18:44 am
how many airlines do you know that are buying 732's?
Title: RIP
Post by: Vamerica on April 04, 2008, 01:20:41 am
airlines in S. America use 737-200's. Some small airlines in Canada. And even some in europe ans africa.
Title: RIP
Post by: SATA on April 04, 2008, 01:27:10 am
i just doubt it
Title: RIP
Post by: Vamerica on April 04, 2008, 01:28:26 am
well
Title: RIP
Post by: SATA on April 04, 2008, 01:33:37 am
.....
Title: RIP
Post by: Vamerica on April 04, 2008, 01:39:51 am
so any thoughts on Alaska and horizon.
Title: RIP
Post by: SATA on April 04, 2008, 01:46:24 am
nope not really
Title: RIP
Post by: Vamerica on April 04, 2008, 01:49:14 am
well do you think any European airline is going to file chap. 11?
Title: RIP
Post by: SATA on April 04, 2008, 01:53:47 am
yep palmair and EAL or EAC they are basicly the same company but they only operate 732's and dont have cash to buy new planes so sadly there will soon be an ending
Title: RIP
Post by: Vamerica on April 04, 2008, 01:56:50 am
i see.
Title: RIP
Post by: OAAir on April 04, 2008, 02:17:47 pm
Chapter 11 is actually a section of the US Bankruptcy Code, and a rather unusual one when you look at how other nations have traditionally handled insolvencies. I believe that there is now a European version of Chapter 11, but don't quote me on that. As for the shutting down operations, if you look back at history when airlines have filed for Chapter 11 they will almost always bring all their aircraft back to their base of operations to protect them from creditors seizing them at the out stations before the filing is official. Braniff did this both times, Continental did it both times, Pan Am did it, Eastern did it - it is simply an asset protection move. I believe if we looked at the recent filings you don't see this pattern as the airlines are filing much earlier than they used to (Chap. 11 has lost it's stigma) and since the aircraft can't be seized if they are current on their payments, it is unnecessary. The standard pattern has been to shut down for a couple of days, then to begin limited operations again, focusing on only your most profitable routes and aircraft. There are cases however where the Chapter 11 morphs into a Chapter 7 liquidation filing, a la Eastern, and that is when the assets get sold and the company simply ceases to exist. But almost always, they will try to reorganize under Chapter 11 first.
ATA was not owned by Southwest but rather was working as an affiliate to fly the routes, mainly Hawaiian, that Southwest wasn't ready to undertake on their own. They also handled the charters and vacation packages for SW.
Title: RIP
Post by: AustraliaConnect on April 04, 2008, 02:33:22 pm
QANTAS BETTER NOT DIE!!! :lol: but im not sure about their rediculously expensive prices... $2199 to LAX from Melbourne on special V Australia - Melbourne to LAX via SYD -$1200 on special
Title: RIP
Post by: iranair777 on April 04, 2008, 02:46:27 pm
im just hoping IR will take up those 732's :lol:
Title: RIP
Post by: AirHanoverInternational on April 04, 2008, 07:40:56 pm
Quote from: "Vamerica"
now, who next?
Well, there are some I would keep an eye on:
Europe: Alitalia
South America: Maybe TAM?
North America: Freedom Airlines? Delta has announced to cancel their contract for 34 of their 50 seaters (representing about 75% of Freedom Airline's fleet) in May. Maybe its parent company MESA(? can't remember) will shut down their subsidiaries business to protect themselves.
Others may be affected, too, as Lufthansa's officials said somewhere that their contracts "are flexible". If traffic volume is at a kind of peak now (at least in the Western World by some analysts) there will definetly die other airlines within the second quarter of this year.
Quote from: "OAAir"
Chapter 11 is actually a section of the US Bankruptcy Code, and a rather unusual one when you look at how other nations have traditionally handled insolvencies. I believe that there is now a European version of Chapter 11, but don't quote me on that.
There is indeed something like that in Germany (at least) but I dont know if this is handled the same as Chapter 11.
Quote from: "OAAir"
ATA was not owned by Southwest but rather was working as an affiliate to fly the routes, mainly Hawaiian, that Southwest wasn't ready to undertake on their own. They also handled the charters and vacation packages for SW.
You are right. One or two years ago Southwest passed about $20M to ATA receiving gate slots from them in return. ATA was planned to fly longer international routes (e.g. Cancun) on behalf of Southwest for the next year. AFAIK Southwest does not have international routes (at least no long-hauls).
Title: RIP
Post by: MrOrange on April 04, 2008, 08:27:24 pm
Looking at the latest news we're getting on the Alitalia - AirFrance/KLM takeover, it's not going to happen soon. Italian unions don't bow down easily, so it seems, and AirFrance/KLM looks like it's getting tired of the entire takeover. Also, Berlusconi being not-so-happy about losing an Italian icon, especially one that should have a big presence in Milan (IIRC, could be Rome but I forgot) seeing as that's kind of his favourite city, means Alitalia might not disappear that quick.
Title: RIP
Post by: sla31 on April 05, 2008, 02:53:15 pm
Title: RIP
Post by: AirHanoverInternational on April 05, 2008, 03:30:08 pm
Yeah, just read it :cry:
Title: RIP
Post by: Vamerica on April 05, 2008, 05:27:03 pm
i herd it last night on the news
Title: RIP
Post by: SATA on April 05, 2008, 05:50:24 pm
they have a really nice livery
Title: RIP
Post by: iranair777 on April 05, 2008, 05:56:29 pm
why is there suddenly a increase of airlines shutting down? 10 going to 2-3 weeks is horrendous!
Title: RIP
Post by: SATA on April 05, 2008, 05:59:30 pm
Fuel Expenses have risin :?
Title: RIP
Post by: beerchaser301 on April 05, 2008, 07:01:36 pm
Personally, I think Alaska will be fine, They have a good niche, Some say, and I am not sure I believe it but it could happen, SWA might be in trouble with the FAA fines. But they are pretty darn strong so they should recover. Beerchaser
Title: RIP
Post by: Vamerica on April 05, 2008, 07:08:16 pm
SWA will probably not go file chap. 11. They are safe.
Title: RIP
Post by: zkvac on April 05, 2008, 10:27:34 pm
To be honest I'm not surprised about Skybus..
Watch Qantas (Jetonnect) in NZ here.
Title: RIP
Post by: Scandalian Airlines on April 05, 2008, 10:27:35 pm
Quote from: "SATA"
Quote from: "Vamerica"
now, who next?
Oh i think Kalitta Air cargo will be next cause they only operate the 741 and 742 and there so fuel thirsty.
I think not, there is a world wide demand for cargo, especially odd sized and heavy cargo, so I think Kalitta will be around for a good while. Also, cargo flights differs from PAX flights in a way, no cargo no flight no fuel expense, PAX with low loads need to go anyway, and it's more or less cargo that helps the flight break even on PAX routes as well. KLM has used that fact successfully for many years with their fleet of combo 747's, but even on a full pax 747 there is still room for a lot of small sized cargo.
Title: RIP
Post by: AirHanoverInternational on April 05, 2008, 10:51:02 pm
Quote from: "Scandalian Airlines"
I think not, there is a world wide demand for cargo, especially odd sized and heavy cargo, so I think Kalitta will be around for a good while. Also, cargo flights differs from PAX flights in a way, no cargo no flight no fuel expense, PAX with low loads need to go anyway, and it's more or less cargo that helps the flight break even on PAX routes as well. KLM has used that fact successfully for many years with their fleet of combo 747's, but even on a full pax 747 there is still room for a lot of small sized cargo.
Although I agree to your theory I have heard/read somewhere (can't remember where) that cargo airlines complain about more cargo being moved by ships (significantly lower costs but longer shipment times). Especially cargo heading for Asia is pretty cheap by ship. Many ships come overloaded from Asia to Europe but go almost empty back.
Title: RIP
Post by: beerchaser301 on April 06, 2008, 12:14:15 am
Quote from: "AirHanoverInternational"
Quote from: "Scandalian Airlines"
I think not, there is a world wide demand for cargo, especially odd sized and heavy cargo, so I think Kalitta will be around for a good while. Also, cargo flights differs from PAX flights in a way, no cargo no flight no fuel expense, PAX with low loads need to go anyway, and it's more or less cargo that helps the flight break even on PAX routes as well. KLM has used that fact successfully for many years with their fleet of combo 747's, but even on a full pax 747 there is still room for a lot of small sized cargo.
Although I agree to your theory I have heard/read somewhere (can't remember where) that cargo airlines complain about more cargo being moved by ships (significantly lower costs but longer shipment times). Especially cargo heading for Asia is pretty cheap by ship. Many ships come overloaded from Asia to Europe but go almost empty back.
UPS, FEDEX, DHL, and all the others are still making out as our world becomes faster paced still. The idea of gotta be there by 10AM still holds true with most big business. The smaller cargo carriers probably will feel the economic strain of fuel prices though. The problem with pax load now, business travel is starting to dwindle now that technology has grown. Online video meetings are becoming more and more prevalent with rising ticket costs. Not to mention postal service has dropped significantly with the dawn of email. Pretty soon, the only people flying will be tourists. Beerchaser
Title: RIP
Post by: AirHanoverInternational on April 06, 2008, 12:45:00 am
Quote from: "beerchaser301"
UPS, FEDEX, DHL, and all the others are still making out as our world becomes faster paced still. The idea of gotta be there by 10AM still holds true with most big business. The smaller cargo carriers probably will feel the economic strain of fuel prices though. The problem with pax load now, business travel is starting to dwindle now that technology has grown. Online video meetings are becoming more and more prevalent with rising ticket costs. Not to mention postal service has dropped significantly with the dawn of email. Pretty soon, the only people flying will be tourists. Beerchaser
I dont think so. If you are selling products you definetly have to show the customer. The want to see and touch the real product. Therefore I need to travel. But I agree that my office is more or less "paperless" (at least in postal terms). I also agree on scheduled cargo. But if you ship bigger equipment (e.g. machines or fruits) companies use ships, trains or trucks more often.
Unfortunatly I heard some rumor about two other carriers that are in trouble. But those are still rumors. Time will tell. :wink:
Title: RIP
Post by: seafly4fun on April 06, 2008, 06:18:58 am
AS is safe for now even though Virgin America and Jet Blue are starting up routes on the west coast of the US. I say that AS is safe because of their great partnership with national and international partners, some would say it is the best millage program over all for the States. Also not too many airlines off upgrades starting at $50, no fee for checked bags, more flights to California and Alaska, no fee for stand by day of flight and I'm sure a few others that I am missing. Other then bags not arriving at airports when I am landing I've not had any major issues with AS other then not enough flights to ORD but oh well can't have everything.
Title: RIP
Post by: joyu12 on April 06, 2008, 02:47:09 pm
Coast Air ceased operations a little while ago because of pax load (on one route they were using a ATR 42 and only getting 1 pax per flight even thouhg they had cheap tickets!
Title: RIP
Post by: Seattle on April 06, 2008, 09:34:10 pm
Quote from: "seafly4fun"
AS is safe for now even though Virgin America and Jet Blue are starting up routes on the west coast of the US. I say that AS is safe because of their great partnership with national and international partners, some would say it is the best millage program over all for the States. Also not too many airlines off upgrades starting at $50, no fee for checked bags, more flights to California and Alaska, no fee for stand by day of flight and I'm sure a few others that I am missing. Other then bags not arriving at airports when I am landing I've not had any major issues with AS other then not enough flights to ORD but oh well can't have everything.
not to mention several hundred million in the bank. (I think htey have.... about 500 mill)
Virgin America is doing okay, but if they cant get their act togeather soon, they'll be next. SWA is the most profitable carrier in the Americas... they have 2 or 3 billion stocked up :lol:
I think we may even see a legacy go under.... some have very little cash piles.... However, UA looks like it has the most cash as a legacy.
Title: RIP
Post by: TheEagle on April 06, 2008, 09:48:04 pm
I do believe US Airways needs to be watched...I heard that somebody bought out United, I'm looking to see if its true. Too many mergers right now to keep up with. American is doing fine, they grounded some MD80s a couple days ago to do so volunteer inspections and to avoid fines from the FAA. They're also removing them from their fleet little by little and having them replaced by the 737-800. I think they're doing fine.
I don't know about jetBlue though. Its in pretty deep debt with Airbus and DirecTV. Delta is removing certain routes from the Carib because of competition. Theres a new airline opening in May called Aerolíneas Dominicanas based in the Dominican Republic...like all the others that begin from the Dominican Republic, it wont last long.
Title: RIP
Post by: Vamerica on April 06, 2008, 09:53:37 pm
Virgin America has too much backing from Virgin Group to file chap. 11.
Title: RIP
Post by: AirHanoverInternational on April 06, 2008, 10:02:30 pm
Quote from: "TheEagle"
I don't know about jetBlue though. Its in pretty deep debt with Airbus and DirecTV.
I think for the moment they are safe as Lufthansa invested $300M recently. Read this: http://investor.jetblue.com/phoenix.zhtml?c=131045&p=irol-newsArticle&ID=1106237&highlight=lufthansa
Title: RIP
Post by: TheEagle on April 06, 2008, 10:11:51 pm
Quote from: "AirHanoverInternational"
Quote from: "TheEagle"
I don't know about jetBlue though. Its in pretty deep debt with Airbus and DirecTV.
I think for the moment they are safe as Lufthansa invested $300M recently. Read this: http://investor.jetblue.com/phoenix.zhtml?c=131045&p=irol-newsArticle&ID=1106237&highlight=lufthansa
Oh ok, if it wasn't for Lufthansa jetBlue would've only last probably until the end of this year maybe a little more maybe a little less.
Title: RIP
Post by: Seattle on April 06, 2008, 10:36:01 pm
Quote from: "Vamerica"
Virgin America has too much backing from Virgin Group to file chap. 11.
Virgin America has no to little backing from the Virgin Group. None of the legacies have mergered yet...
Here are the "safest" legacy airlines in my opinion:
1. United (they have like 400 million in the bank) 2. NW (also have quite abit of $ in the bank) 3. CO (I remember seeing a report with them having 91 mill) 4. AA (right under CO) 5. DL (deep in debt, however they have alot of new planes) 6. US (dont now much about them, however they look like theyre are okayish
Title: RIP
Post by: yourefired on April 06, 2008, 10:55:33 pm
I'd add jetBlue to the list of airlines that aren't going anywhere.
Title: RIP
Post by: nwadeltaboy on April 07, 2008, 07:34:18 am
Quote from: "Vamerica"
now, who next?
NORTHWEST :(
The only reason ATA stayed afloat was their affiliation with Southwest.
Title: RIP
Post by: Hampo on April 07, 2008, 06:42:56 pm
God, this thread is awesome, kids talking about stuff they have no idea about :lol:
I can see Kalitta buying new aircraft rather than going out of buisness, there is always going to be a need for cargo, not so much pax.
Sam
Title: RIP
Post by: Scandalian Airlines on April 07, 2008, 06:59:41 pm
Quote from: "Hampo"
there is always going to be a need for cargo, not so much pax.
Is there an echo in here? ;)
Title: RIP
Post by: MrOrange on April 07, 2008, 09:14:28 pm
AirFrance/KLM just announced they are going to stop talks with Alitalia, because of the not-so-flexible Italian unions. So unless Berlusconi really has some banks coming out of his sleeve in a few days, add that one to your list.
Title: RIP
Post by: joyu12 on April 08, 2008, 07:32:27 pm
Quote from: "nwaboy"
Quote from: "Vamerica"
now, who next?
NORTHWEST :(
The only reason ATA stayed afloat was their affiliation with Southwest.
Didnt Northwest merge with Delta?
Title: RIP
Post by: Shawa on April 08, 2008, 07:35:42 pm
Quote from: "MrOrange"
AirFrance/KLM just announced they are going to stop talks with Alitalia, because of the not-so-flexible Italian unions. So unless Berlusconi really has some banks coming out of his sleeve in a few days, add that one to your list.
again?
I read in yesterday's paper (Le Devoir, Montréal, Apr.7) that the unions wanted back on the negociation table.
Title: RIP
Post by: MrOrange on April 08, 2008, 11:00:40 pm
As far as I know, they had a deadline set on today with their old offer still standing, and I haven't heard of any new progressions in talks with the unions, so chances are it's not gonna happen and Berlusconi has to come to the rescue.
Title: RIP
Post by: OAAir on April 09, 2008, 01:56:06 am
Quote from: "joyu12"
Quote from: "nwaboy"
Quote from: "Vamerica"
now, who next?
NORTHWEST :(
The only reason ATA stayed afloat was their affiliation with Southwest.
Didnt Northwest merge with Delta?
No. The merger fell apart when the pilot's unions couldn't come to an agreement for merging the seniority lists.
Title: RIP
Post by: jameswyhk on April 09, 2008, 09:05:20 am
Oasis Hong Kong Airlines is ceasing operations today.
Title: RIP
Post by: StephenM on April 09, 2008, 09:27:54 am
It must be the season for bankruptcy.
Title: RIP
Post by: Shawa on April 09, 2008, 09:48:33 am
Title: RIP
Post by: Scandalian Airlines on April 09, 2008, 10:46:00 am
Damn, Oasis, love their livery :( Short lived company, not even 2 years...
Title: RIP
Post by: Jps on April 09, 2008, 11:21:10 am
You'll going to have to get used to it :lol: Soon all will be bankrupt.. :twisted:
I bet Alitalia's next. :lol:
Title: RIP
Post by: jameswyhk on April 09, 2008, 11:23:09 am
I hope Hong Kong Airlines and HKE are the next.
Title: RIP
Post by: sam051 on April 09, 2008, 12:37:03 pm
Well Ansett went bankrupt i think hmmmm three four years ago. Qantas planes are slowing detereorating, but will be refreshed. Hmm reminds me of Ansett. Jetstar, Virgin Blue (Budget Airlines) are still here and going well. Tiger airways here aswell but will soon cease. Qantas and Virgin have taken away staff from tiger....
Oh well.
Qantas is (i think) Slowly dying, to bad they're a good airline. (free food, comfort not to bad, entertainment, friendly staff, relatively quick service and the first airline to start and airline within an airline. How original. (Jetstar) I hate Jetstar! :evil:
Title: RIP
Post by: czhang on April 09, 2008, 12:59:30 pm
Quote from: "jameswyhk"
Oasis Hong Kong Airlines is ceasing operations today.
Really? I just went to their website and it doesn't seem like it...
Their latest press release:
New appointments further strengthen Oasis Hong Kong Airlines sales force Hong Kong, March 19, 2008
Oasis Hong Kong Airlines (Oasis) has appointed two industry veterans to further strengthen their sales team: Winnie Ma, Deputy General Sales Manager – Hong Kong & Southern China; and Esther Wang, Deputy General Manager – International Sales & Distribution.
I know thats March but how many airlines do you know of that actually post their "latest news" on the web...wait I may have contradicted myself there... ... ... ... ... ...no I didn't, if they were ceasing operations you'd think they'd tell us :lol: on the contrary, their reservation system appears to be undergoing "maintenance"...now I'm confused :(
Title: RIP
Post by: dktc on April 09, 2008, 01:02:50 pm
Title: RIP
Post by: Hampo on April 09, 2008, 06:20:46 pm
One of their aircraft is currently at LGW, parked.
The aircraft will not be moving until they find out who's going to be paying for it to go back home.
Another airline lost...
Title: RIP
Post by: shadghost on April 09, 2008, 07:12:27 pm
The person wondering about alaska air, there is no way it is going out, Alaska Air runs a lot of cargo in alaska with it combi (1/2 cargo 1/2 people) and it is the only way to get to a lot of places in alaska, along with the main airline out of alaska (rents almost all of ANC (anchorage) and fairbanks airports) Also they just recenintaly bought a LOT of new aircraft
Title: RIP
Post by: czhang on April 10, 2008, 12:13:09 am
Well whatdya know, you're right! NOW the Oasis website says it...
Edit: here is the notice on the oasis website:
Notice to Passengers
It is with regret that Oasis Hong Kong Airlines announces that the airline has this morning applied to the Hong Kong Court to appoint a provisional liquidator. The Court has appointed Edward Middleton and Patrick Cowley of KPMG as the provisional liquidators, and they have assumed control of the airline with effect from 1400h HKG time today.
Our flight operations have been cancelled until further notice. The Provisional Liquidators are liaising with other airlines in order to help customers make alternate travel arrangements as quickly as possible.
Title: RIP
Post by: neo on April 10, 2008, 05:57:19 pm
Quote from: "Hampo"
One of their aircraft is currently at LGW, parked.
The aircraft will not be moving until they find out who's going to be paying for it to go back home.
Another airline lost...
that plane is backed to Hong Kong already that means 4 planes now parked in HKIA
and one is still flying in Africa
Title: RIP
Post by: AirHanoverInternational on April 10, 2008, 06:48:30 pm
I have seen an ATA aircraft (DC-10 or MD-11; was too far away) at LEJ today. Seemed that it had not moved since I saw it last Friday.
EDIT: Have a look at this page.
http://www.justplanes.com/AirlineHist.html
If airlines will continue to cease operations (or to merge) at this speed we will probably have 70 airlines less beginning 2009 than at the end of 2007 :cry:
Title: RIP
Post by: echoney on April 11, 2008, 01:46:33 am
CX is helping again really nice of CX
Title: RIP
Post by: jameswyhk on April 11, 2008, 10:42:40 am
Quote from: "echoney"
CX is helping again really nice of CX
Although BA says that it is going to help Oasis' passengers too but actually all the flights were already full before BA announced that.
Title: RIP
Post by: Hampo on April 11, 2008, 03:57:25 pm
Frontier have now filed a chapter 11
Title: RIP
Post by: OAAir on April 13, 2008, 11:42:34 pm
Quote from: "OAAir"
Quote from: "joyu12"
Quote from: "nwaboy"
Quote from: "Vamerica"
now, who next?
NORTHWEST :(
The only reason ATA stayed afloat was their affiliation with Southwest.
Didnt Northwest merge with Delta?
No. The merger fell apart when the pilot's unions couldn't come to an agreement for merging the seniority lists.
Just happened to be scanning the news and the Wall Street Journal is now saying that the Delta-Northwest announcement could come Tuesday - even without the support of the pilot's unions :shock: Brings back thoughts of Pan Am-National....... http://online.wsj.com/article/SB120811358101510993.html?mod=googlenews_wsj
Title: RIP
Post by: CornField on April 14, 2008, 03:58:56 am
There are two Skyway Beeches sitting at the Beechcraft/Raytheon Maintence Hanger at RFD.... Its kinda ironic that just a year ago there were four ex Fly-I CRJ's sitting on the other side of th airport from these... The CRJ's went to OO and now operate as YX*
Title: RIP
Post by: CornField on April 14, 2008, 04:05:17 am
Quote from: "Hampo"
Frontier have now filed a chapter 11
Chapter 11 is a LONG way from a shutdown or Chapter 7.
The folks who own those very nice Airbii aren't going to be happy though...
But I believe Hampo was one of the two that got it right.... right now.. Pax, sexy but not good, Cargo decidedly not sexy, but a great place to be... (Okay for airline dorks, cargo is sexy also)
Title: RIP
Post by: Blue Sky Mine on April 14, 2008, 06:50:49 pm
Quote from: "CornField"
(Okay for airline dorks, cargo is sexy also)
I was just about to intervene- where else could you still see all those beautiful old birds?
But the list of bankruptcies sounds quite scary. Carriers like AZ better get some sense and save themselves!!!
Title: RIP
Post by: Seattle on April 15, 2008, 03:57:42 am
The Death List: :twisted: (in my opinion) "major risk":
Express Jet Mesa Aviation Group
Moderate to Major risk:
Silver Jet - I would think - maybe :P Virgin America - At this point, however, this would meen SRB doesn't intervene Frontier - I think they'll make it
Low Risk- But still at risk:
AA - But... that would probably Chap. 11 DL and NW ... seem to be maybe merging UA and CO... "supposedly" are going to merge if DL/NW does US ... no comment... Air Tran ... it was said by the News that they may be in trouble...
Thats all I can think of... I dont know about in Europe other than Alitalia... Olympic will never fall becuase there owned by the government and there controlled by unions.... which happen to be "stronger" than the actual government
Title: RIP
Post by: czhang on April 15, 2008, 06:49:12 am
NW and DL merged, see my thread :D
Title: RIP
Post by: Hampo on April 16, 2008, 09:28:03 pm
EOS look like they're about to fold too
Southwests fuel bill for 08 is looking to be at the same amount as their profits too...
Title: RIP
Post by: AirHanoverInternational on April 18, 2008, 09:53:06 pm
I knew it from the start: Alitalia was in the news today again. Seems that the elections brought Mr. Berlusconi into a better position to fight for is flag carrier.
Mentioned possibilities: 1. AF/KLM (still) 2. Aeroflot :shock: 3. Lufthansa (but possibly they are afraid of the unions)
Let's see how this thing will finally end. Two choices (in my opinion):
1. Shut down operations (can't really think of that) 2. Union power will be reduced and someone will take over this airline kicking "some" butts to keep at least some of the 20,000 jobs
Title: RIP
Post by: Blue Sky Mine on April 19, 2008, 12:30:12 pm
It appears that the EC refused to permit another state loan for AZ until 2011.