Messages

1

General Chat / Re: Unrealistic routes

« on: July 02, 2011, 10:52:25 pm »

Wasn't really making a suggestion, but for reference, the airport where I live is actually in the game, and it only has 120k passengers ingame.. we get flights three times a day from American Eagle..

I kinda have to think that the game engine makes multi-frequency 'realistic' routes something that doesn't appeal to everybody, since you kinda want to grow.. best way to do that is spam 1 freq routes everywhere..

I guess spamming is too harsh of a word, if I should say. Spamming would have worked better in the old form, when an airline could have as many .5s around as possible. There are quite a few airlines that likely just send a single 737 sized aircraft, and nothing more!

I should find the thread from a few years back about .5s. It made got real nasty if I remember.

http://stephenm.org/smfforum/index.php?topic=2414.0

Maybe some adjustment for very large cities would be good, personally, I would be up for it! I'm just wondering though, if there is anything of a Hub effect programmed into the game yet. That alone would be a great help there, then would make multifreqs logical!

2

General Chat / Re: Time Issuies

« on: July 02, 2011, 09:14:21 pm »

For me, I had a small problem at first when I started playing again, since I usually choose Rzeszow as my first base, as it isn't exactly the most profitable base to have (since with the aircraft I got as default, it caused me to run into some range issues), but after the 2nd year, I got my first Let-410, then ordered a few more, then my first IL-14M, then more Antonov An-24s and so forth. So basically said, things will pick up once you get to a point where you can start ordering 1 medium sized T-Prop a day. I'm currently at a point where everyday I get a new set of aircraft delivered, and every day I get to place an order for a set of aircraft.

Honestly, the best thing that this could be compared to is growing a plant, like a tree or a shrub of some sort. You plant the seeds, and for some time, not much is going on, then after some time, you get to see your plant spring into action and you do all sorts of stuff, like picking off fruits, or having to shape it up to look good, and if you're in a place like Florida, it's something you'll usually be doing at least once a week (when it comes to shrubs, though you'll still get Oranges and other citrus fruits basically year round too.   )

3

General Chat / Re: Unrealistic routes

« on: July 02, 2011, 09:07:08 pm »

That is simple economy, more supply than demand = lower revenue/lower profit.  In this game is more competition than in real life and airline must look at it. If you will be making multifreq routes and will be competing with big airlines they will be using big planes and price will go drasticaly down and you will be not making mostly any profit and your airline will be going to bankrupt.

Yes, economics works that way, but I don't think it fits in the context of some parts of this game.. airlines typically run more than one flight to an airport a day (Especially if it's an international airport)...

Sure, airlines typically don't pack 100% on every flight that they run, but they very typically manage a high loadfactor all things considered. That's what I think fly757s is trying to get at, the general game strategy is to run 1 freq routes everywhere while normal business strategy in real life would be to run as many flights as you could to an airport to balance the costs of renting out the gate at the airport..

I've nothing against the game engine myself (As it runs a lot better than another that I've played), but I do see the point..

That wouldn't make sense either, as not every airport needs more than 1 flight a day. I'm sure an American Airport, like Memphis (which I hear has been on the decline passenger side IRL) would have many flights classified as "1 freq." To be honest, more than 1 flight a day would make a lot of sense out of very larger airports though (though to be honest, I have found myself doing more multi-freq flying in the form of multi-plane flying on a route, mostly to balance out the effect caused by a smaller competitor that just started leasing a lot of 120 seaters recently and flying almost exclusively 2x on all the routes. I suppose that is a large reason also why some airlines operate multi routes too, to attract travelers to more choices. It did on the other hand increase my Operating profit a bit, granted, it possibly came with the added cost of maintenance, but it is a technique I had used before back in Public World 9 when I had a similar competitor in Budapest. I think within a Game year or two, he got sick of seeing more aircraft on routes he randomly plopped a Caravelle or a Boeing 737-200 on and packed up shop there.

4

General Chat / Re: Time Issuies

« on: July 02, 2011, 07:06:07 pm »

Time Issuies I think are a problem in the game I don't know if you mind it, but in the game it really takes 1 day for 1 day to happen so it takes five years in all which bothers me. If you support "bump".

Don't know what you mean. In the game, 1 day (24 real hours) is 1 game month. 

5

General Chat / Re: Unrealistic routes

« on: July 02, 2011, 03:32:56 am »

That is simple economy, more supply than demand = lower revenue/lower profit.  In this game is more competition than in real life and airline must look at it. If you will be making multifreq routes and will be competing with big airlines they will be using big planes and price will go drasticaly down and you will be not making mostly any profit and your airline will be going to bankrupt.

Not to mention, those same airlines not only have larger planes most of the time, but also more of them to place on the same route, and could even afford to lose some money on a few routes, just to sweep out the competition. The game used to have a problem (fixed years ago, but I was playing my first rounds at the time) where people would have all of their routes to .5s. It caused quite some controversy early on, but was fixed in the end to where each aircraft could only have 2 .5 frequencies only. 

I do have a feeling though, that having the code making an "optimal" amount of frequencies to max out the demand may cause another Pandora's box of sorts to open up. There was an other very similar game that worked a lot like that (and many older players of this game were very likely players of that game too). When I last played, a typical 10 year round went like this: year 1 and 2 were productive for everyone, people were getting their first Airbi and Boeings. By year 3, the larger guys would really start to build up, by year 4, the top 5 or so had basically taken over most of the routes, and no one could afford to make a decent profit. Admittedly, Airline Mogul forces the Hub and Spoke system more, where this one was a bit more free, and didn't require Hub/Focus City to be one point of the route, thus allowing such domination to take place. Of course, to add, that game also had a different profit function too. In that game, a full plane was not as profitable as a plane with like 2/3s of the seats left. Of course, all the insane problems with that game is what lead to this game being created.

6

Game Strategy / Re: Best long haul aircraft?

« on: July 02, 2011, 02:49:50 am »

I have purchased a pair of DC-8-55s a month apart from each other.  I get my first in two months, so I'll let you know how it turns out.

Looking at this aircraft, it looks quite promising, especially on the routes you'd like to use it on! Not sure how crowded LHR is right now in your world. If it's not as crowded, you may even get away with using 250 seater maybe that isn't too badly priced!

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Game Strategy / Re: Best long haul aircraft?

« on: July 01, 2011, 08:58:39 pm »

The world I'm in, the year is 1977, but this, and other rounds in the general time era, I've usually had great luck with the Tu-114D, it has a range of about 6500 nautical miles, speed of 432 knots (ok, not the fastest, but still not the slowest either), and 120 seats, and costs about some 75 mil to buy new. The aircraft is fairly flexible (and by that, I mean simple to use in a variety of situations) in my opinion, so even those who operate out of airports with 2 million pax could possibly pull a nice profit and keep it for a few years. Downside for you, in 1981, it's discontinued that year, so order up as much if you can if you find them interesting. In the years it's offered, it's possibly the most ordered long range aircraft simply because of those reasons! Sort of like how (and I'm tangent from airlines here into railroads), how the PKP Class EU06 and 07 has operated for almost 50 years.

If you want a very rough estimate if it could do those routes 2x, you can go to the Great Circle Mapper (link: http://www.gcmap.com/ ), set up the route you want, here is JFK-LHR with a 2x freq. applied and the L1011-500's speed:
http://www.gcmap.com/mapui?P=LHR-JFK-LHR-JFK-LHR-JFK-LHR-JFK&MS=wls&DU=nm&SG=525&SU=kts
39 hours, so definitely out of the question. A lot changes between 77' and 81' though, so I can't say if there will be faster, non- supersonic planes that can do it off the top of my head in the game by then. If you could get something with a 600 kts or 700kts, you may be lucky there.

As for 747s and fuel efficiency? I suppose if you can make good profit off them, then they're good! The problem with 747s is their price. They are quite expensive aircraft to buy, and since the Maintenance is still a function of the MSRP and the age of the aircraft, it makes it a VERY expensive plane to own, but seeing you're out of LHR, you can possibly do something with it (though I would recommend smaller, cheaper aircraft if possible. The 747 in this game can do what the 747 did in the beginning, kill off a lot of airlines that wanted it because they just wanted a giant beer can in their fleet, but with no idea of how to use it properly.

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Game Strategy / Re: What is the best plane after the Bristol Pullman and when does it arrive?

« on: June 14, 2011, 10:06:36 am »

Now, I'm just using my general knowledge and Wikipedia and aviastar (if I had Jane's all the world's aircraft, that's what I'd use as that's what they use for most of the aircraft), since I've never had the privilege to start so early yet.

I hope you don't mind an overview from what I see for the next 5 years.

According the Aviastar, the Ford Trimotor, has a capacity of 17 (though Wikipedia lists 10, so I suppose that 17 is more or less a paratrooper config), a max. speed of 130 kts (wikipedia shows 78 kts as a cruising speed, so I'm not sure which piece of data they'd follow here.) It's max range falls short shows up as 478nm.  It becomes available in 1925. So if that is correct, then that should be the first plane with more than 14 passengers. So from what I see, if the max speed and that larger capacity is used, then you have 2 of the 3 combined.

Next aircraft that may come to intrest to you in terms of passenger capacity is the Armstrong Whitworth Argosy. According to Aviastar and Wikipedia, it has capacity of 20 passengers. Unfortunately, from what I see, it suffers from low range (352 nautical mile range) and low speed (max 96 kts, cruising 78). So from what I see, only 1 out of 3 here.

Next Plane, also introduced in 1926 is the Belriot 165. This aircraft has accommodations for 16 passengers. The max. speed is under what you are looking for (100 kts), and the range is less than the Argosy's at 283 nautical miles.

 In 1929, you should look forward to the Boeing Model 80, it has a max capacity (according to aviastar) of 18 passengers (though it did also mention in the history 12, not sure what the game will follow), a fairly attractive speed for what you're looking for (108 cruising, 120 max), Though on the range, it does fall short for what you are looking for in longer range (400 nm).

Also in 1929, you'll possibly have a VERY GOOD year on the capacity front! The Fokker F32 is introduced, and it can carry 32 passengers, it has a cruising speed of 102 knots and a max speed of 134 knots. It also has a fairly attractive range of 643 nautical miles! Something I think you should watch for. I don't know the stats the game will use, so check in the game in 1928.

Next in 1930 is the Junkers G.38, capacity from what I read here 34, range 540 nautical miles, cruising speed of around 113 with a max. speed of 121.


From what I see, your first chance to get an aircraft with all 3 characteristics is the Douglas DC-3! It lists on Aivastar as 21-28 passengers, with a range of 1304 nautical miles, and a cruise speed of 158 knots! I think though that the game may list the range lower, but from what I remember using these in a late 1940s/early 1950s round, that speed and capacity should be correct. It is introduced in 1935, and from what I see, the mid-1930s will possibly the be era you may need to look out for! Right now, you're in the era when the concept of the airline is still in it's infancy and hasn't exactly gotten all that far yet and aerodynamic design was just starting to be understood better. Ideas like flutter were not understood yet, and lead to some impressive failures, such as the Kalinin K-7 from the early 1930s (which isn't in the game, but from what I read, if used in a civilian layout, could seat up to 120 passengers.)

9

Game Data / Re: Why is the Airbus A300B1 in the game?

« on: June 12, 2011, 11:33:45 pm »

Sorry for entering in a rather old topic, but if you look, you'll notice a TON of aircraft that never made it past the Prototype stage in the game or only had a very small amount built. These include the PZL MD-12, the Bushmaster 2000 (only 2 built), Tupolev Tu-70, Tu-110, The original IL-18 (the one introduced in the early 1950s, not the later, very different aircraft, thought that was introduced in 47'), the now cancelled Tu-334 (2 built), AIDC XC-2 and the DC-1 (only 1 built). And that is a handful of what I know right off the top of my head!

But I don't have a problem with that, it does expand the amount of aircraft we can get, and show somewhat of an alternate reality of how it would be if these aircraft did make it past those low build schemes. Afterall, there are also a lot of conversion aircraft (like the various DC-3 T-props and the Valsan 727s, none of which I believe were built new.) As long as the aircraft isn't filled with "paper airplanes" (aircraft that never had reached the prototype stage), I suppose there isn't a problem!

10

Game Strategy / Re: Servicing small Alaskan Airports from Anchorage.

« on: June 12, 2011, 11:16:28 pm »

Has anyone ever hubbed in Anchorage?  I am creating a worldwide legacy carrier, and I currently have service to every single airport in the USA...except the Alaskan airports.  I opened up a hub at Anchorage and am serving about a dozen of the largest ones.  I am not making a ton, but they are profitable.  Here are a few details.

The current year is 1924
I am using Bristol Pullmans, 14 passengers.
Some of the rural Alaskan airports have as few as 0 passengers.

Can it be profitable to serve these airports from Anchorage?  If so, do I need a smaller plane, say 8 seats, or a larger plane with more like 30 seats?

Currently a flight from Anchorage to an airport in Alaska with 0 passengers with the Pullman will generate about $2300, which will just cover the gate cost.  I'll never make the money to cover the aircraft.

Or should I just serve them all from Seattle when cheap, small, long range aircraft become available in the 70s?

I can't speak for all the Alaskan Airports, but I think you can get a good, decent profit from ANC with an aircraft like that (don't know it's costs, so I can't say more, some more stats on the aircraft could be helpful, as the only aircraft I have good experience with are aircraft availble between the 1950s- early 1970s). For anything less than 5000, I usually go for anything in the x<20 seat range, maybe even x<15. If you can get the aircraft for under 1 mil, it is an even larger plus. I would look at first getting all the airports around the 600nm range that have more than 500 passengers first though. At least to help cover some of the costs here.

11

Game Strategy / Re: Long haul Operations; when to start.

« on: June 11, 2011, 06:12:26 am »

Good question, but with some very a very complex answers I'd have to say, mostly because of the amount of approaches that could be taken.

From the best memory of my experience (which excluding this round last was 2008)
If by long haul, you mean distance is greater than 3000nm, and with aircraft with more than 50 seats and worth more than 24 mil, definitely wait until you are sure you have found yourself with a sold, strong network within 2500 nm of the base (and that's for the airline to decide, because of where they may be based. Think about flying from an airport like, let's say Budapest, which I believe is typically listed in the game around 8 million passengers. I believe one could get away with it (though with a smaller aircraft, like a IL-18D, though a few IL-62s wouldn't be bad for routes that lead to the Megaports abroad) with at least 50 flights, due to the fact that it isn't an airport with a lot of cut throat competition (like your CDGs and LHRs) and is a fairly decent size. A smaller airport, like, let's take Kaliningrad for example, which enjoys the same geographical advantages of Budapest, but a far smaller passenger size should look at far more.

I think in most, if not all cases, in this game, an airline should focus more on the regional/domestic flying, especially as the maintenance costs of large aircraft suited for long distance travel (like even the IL-62) will really take a hard hit. But if you know smaller aircraft that can do the job, I'd say go for it. Much smaller cost (sometimes like a fifth of it), with a third of capacity and maybe 1000nm less range and 100 kts less cruising speed can be surprisingly worth it. If you're playing a 60s/70s round, something like the IL-18D or Tu-114D is usually very well worth it's money. But as with planning aircraft for your routes, one has to be careful and plan well ahead even when first getting these.

Here is a good example of what I had in Public World #9:
Antonov An-10A 18
Antonov An-24V* 73
Boeing 727-100 Executive 4
Breda-Zappata BZ-308 27
CSS-12 4
Ilyushin Il-14M 45
Ilyushin Il-18D 16
Ilyushin Il-62* 4
Industriewerk Il-14P 6
Nord 260 Super Broussard 1
Tupolev Tu-104A 3
Tupolev Tu-104V 13
Tupolev Tu-114D 37
Tupolev Tu-134* 35
Tupolev Tu-134A* 70
Yakovlev Yak-40* 26

*Launch Customer for specific type.

I had as bases:
Rzeszow
Leningrad
Kiev
Valencia
Milan Bergamo
Budapest
Odessa, Ukraine

So you can see, I was based out of some small to medium sized airports. I recall by the end of the round, I was the 14th most valuable active airline and still rising at that point.

But as I said, things may have changed in the years since I last played. The costs may have been revised, as well as other algorithms (though from what I feel, it doesn't look like so).

12

Game Strategy / Re: Charging for drinks etc.

« on: October 09, 2008, 05:14:22 pm »

Well, either way, I possibly wouldn't charge more than 10 Euros for everything either way, though in my W9 airline, I only charge for Alcohol and Snacks. Much everything else is provided free (a bit of good ol' 1960s class  .)

If you do think about it, charging higher prices might make long haul with large aircraft a bit more profitable and reasonable.

13

Game Strategy / Re: Getting tired of 'big guys'

« on: October 07, 2008, 08:50:07 pm »

What's the solution?

Stay away from basing in bigger airports until you are really sure you got the hang of it. That is typically the best strategy to avoid massive competition.

14

General Chat / Re: Critique of new features

« on: October 06, 2008, 12:55:31 pm »

I didn't read all 5 pages of the thread, but I did read most of the 1st, so if something I said had a response to it, sorry about that.

As said before, a bunch of stuff is just jumping out at you at once, but that could be because of the new look. I too also miss the average LF being in the same area where you could find the Cash/Airline value/Date. This was usually used to make sure there wasn't any huge significant drop in LF by me. Also, the aircraft list lacks a "Fleet" column, which is something I used for knowing how many aircraft I needed to put in for each fleet.

I too personally miss the old green look myself, even if it is outdated. Not to mention I think it would've behaved better while I'm at home (I have dial-up there, so I don't know how all this new flashy stuff might act on it, but I am scared that it might shut me out of the game for the most part.)

Other than that, it is an interesting.

15

General Chat / Re: Registration

« on: September 26, 2008, 12:14:05 pm »

The reason why Aeroflot doesn't put their planes under the RA- Register is because it is expensive to import Boeing products and then register them in the RA- products in Russia. So since Aeroflot leases their aircraft, they will put them under the registration that the aircraft owners originally put it under (like EI (Ireland) or VP (Bermuda. If you look at Aeroflot's Soviet/Russian builds, you'll notice that they are under the RA- register.

I know that. But it would still be awsome if you could register your planes in another country in AM...

Can't you do that through "Name" though? I know that the aircraft already comes with a registration, but that is usually how I have my regs done. Not to mention, I view my way as realistic too compared to that of the Game's.